Participants:
Steve Wershing
Julie Littlechild
Brad Swineheart
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Welcome to Becoming Referrable, the podcast that shows you how to become the kind of advisor people can’t stop talking about. I’m Steve Wershing.
Business development for professional service firms was turned upside down when the world went into pandemic just about a year ago and among the most affected people were advisors who attracted new clients primarily through seminars. And the leader in seminar marketing of course is White Glove. On this episode, we talk with Brad Swineheart, vice president of channel marketing and business development for White Glove.
When we all went into lockdown, White Glove pivoted and refocused its attention from seminars into webinars, but whether or not you utilize webinars, you can use what Brad and White Glove learned to leverage the virtual environment, to meet new clients and get referrals over the internet and social media. Our conversation includes what makes for a successful virtual event, how attendee follow up is different from live and virtual events and how to do it successfully virtually and how to translate your presentation skills to the virtual environment. There’s a lot of timely and practical advice in this episode so let’s get right to our conversation with Brad Swineheart.
Brad Swineheart, welcome to the Becoming Referrable podcast. It’s great to have you.
Hey, thanks for having me on. It sounds like it’s going to be a lot of fun.
I think it will be. White Glove has made its name offering a seminar system for advisors and obviously a lot changed when the pandemic came in and all of a sudden we couldn’t get together in groups. What’s happened to you guys? And what’s happened with advisors who had in person seminars as a big element of their marketing plan?
Yeah, that’s a great question. For us specifically, we went right probably our best month ever in February. We were doing close to 900 in person events all across the US and Canada, right into March where we did zero. And we were in the exact same boat as advisors of having to figure out what’s next? Or what else can we do? Luckily for us, we had just brought on a brand new CEO who in his previous company, ran webinars for professionals. They trained professional business owners through a webinar series and they ran millions of hours of webinars. He just knew exactly what to do. And he said, “Oh, this is what we’re going to do.”
And we were able to kind of uniquely pivot in the industry because we had the marketing down, we had our follow-up procedures down. We had a bunch of event planners that could now learn the tech of webinars and run that for advisors. We pivoted almost overnight. And what was really interesting was to see the advisors we work with, what their take on it was. And there is there was really two clear groups. There was the group that said, “You know what? This is going to blow over. I’m just going to wait.” And then there was the group that said, “Hey, you know what? Let’s look at this as an opportunity and see what we can do to drive new business into the office.”
Webinars were obviously a big part of that, but there’s other things that you do. In general, what do you think that when you’re looking at advisors who are succeeding at this and who are progressive in kind of embracing all of this change, what are some of the ways that they are getting in front of prospects now?
Well, what’s interesting is that physical handshake has gone away. And for a long time advisors really relied on that. Seeing someone in person, having them come into the office, sitting down across from somebody. And that was almost immediately ripped away from them overnight and what we’ve seen and what we’ve put a lot of resources in to help our advisors, is having a virtual handshake, if you will. And where that starts is really an omnichannel approach, where you have value and credibility across social media, emails, your websites, be stalkable online, all these things that advisors kind of ignored because it was like, let’s just fill the top of the funnel. That was always the go to. Let’s just put more leads in the top, but now prospects will absolutely look you up online before they ever decide to do business with you and we wanted to make sure that we were able to support advisors in those efforts.
We pivoted, we put a ton of resources into a podcasting platform that we just launched. We do social media management for advisors. Very hands free so they don’t have to learn what Mark Zuckerberg is doing in the back office at Facebook. We’ll do that for them, but it’s really to increase their credibility where their prospects are going to find them. And the advisors that have that, the advisors that are credible in their network, their captive network, those are the ones that are actually converting those now virtual leads into actual clients.
I’ve heard a lot of advisors say over time that, “It’s all about the personal connection. You have to have a personal relationship. It’s all about getting belly to belly with someone before you can build up the rapport to make them into a client.” Either what were we missing in that? Or what are the actual things that do that? Or what’s changed that now enable advisors to attract clients without that kind of in person interaction?
What’s interesting is so many different industries have the same business mentality. It’s a relationship business and that’s just Sales 101. People work with people that they like. It’s not always the best lead magnets. It’s not always the superstar person that they want to reach out to. People will work with people that they like. And outside of the financial industry, people have been doing that virtual for years. White Glove, we do 98% of our sales totally virtually. I have advisors that I would consider very close friends that I’ve never met in person. And what you do is be able to become referable, relatable and a real person digitally. There’s so many outlets right now that advisors have to look at as opportunities and not something to be scared of.
There’s too many advisors that I talk to that say, “I don’t want anything to do with Facebook or I don’t use LinkedIn, I don’t know what it’s for.” And those are opportunities to not only showcase your professionalism, but showcase that you’re a real human being. And people use that. If you’re going to do business with somebody, the first place you go is LinkedIn. Say, “You know what? I’m going to go stalk Julie on LinkedIn and see if she’s credible. Okay, that’s great. I know she’s credible. Well, now I’m going to hop over and see if I can find her on Facebook and see what she’s like as a person.” And if you can have a professional but personal appearance on both of those sites, you’ve already put yourself ahead of somebody that’s staying away from the social media game.
Can we talk about that piece of it a little? Because I know that this idea of showing say a personal Facebook page or sort of letting the professional world see that, creates a bit of angst for some people. Do you think that’s just fundamentally changed? Or how should advisors think about that?
I think it’s both that it has changed, but also just the understanding what each platform is designed to do and what people expect. There’s a different online culture for LinkedIn and Twitter and Facebook and Instagram even. And when you understand that culture, what people expect you to be posting on there, what you expect to see when you pull up your feed, then you can really dive into how you can make yourself relatable in those mediums.
LinkedIn is very professional oriented. There’s not a lot of memes on LinkedIn. There’s not a lot of likes or emojis. It’s professional content, it’s value add, it’s education, information. That’s LinkedIn. It’s designed to be more for professionals and business owners and your prospects a 100% look at it to stalk you because they know, hey, if Brad Swineheart is credible, he’s going to have a LinkedIn profile and I can see what he’s up to. I can see that he’s running a webinar or doing a podcast or whatever. He wrote a book. They can find those things on LinkedIn and stalk you and they absolutely will. I just read a study not too long ago, said over 70% of prospects are going to research a professional on LinkedIn.
And then you take a step back and you look at Facebook. Well, what’s that really designed to do? If you’re constantly pushing business, business, business on Facebook, that’s not why people log into Facebook. People log into Facebook almost as a break from reality. They log in there, they express emotions on Facebook. They share things they like, they laugh, they joke, they have memes. Your business, business, business mentality, isn’t going to play well there. You want to have a professional presence. You don’t want to get on there and go crazy about this opinion or that opinion, but you also want to showcase, you know what? Here’s a picture of the newest coworker as we’re all working from home, it’s my 13 year old dog and she sleeps all day.
That’s something that people can relate to. Or here’s my office staff. We had a Zoom virtual happy hour on Friday and we’re real people and we care about our families. We care about our staff. That type of stuff plays very well on Facebook. And if you can kind of understand the differences between business on LinkedIn for stalkability, professional yet personal on Facebook, that’s how you really have that virtual handshake so when people are looking you up, they find what you want them to find.
And when you think about the kinds of topics, what are some of the, I hate the word best practices, but I’m going to use it anyway just when it comes to social media. What should advisors be thinking about right now to create more engagement and connection?
I love best practices and thought leadership are probably the two that I hear all the time. But you’re right, there’s no better way to put it just yet. If you invent one of those, then that could be a new brand for all of us. And then we’ll be an entire…
I think people use best practices and they mean examples sometimes. And that’s really what we’re.
I think we need to be best practice thought leaders.
Ooh, yes, yes. Here’s my thought leadership best practices. Let’s talk about that for a minute.
Go.
What we see performs best, post something maybe four to five times a week on different. Facebook and LinkedIn, that’s probably right up at the top of the most that you need to be posting. Twitter you can post 10 times a day, it doesn’t matter that feed moves so fast. You’re not going to drown out your audience. LinkedIn, make sure you’re keeping it a little bit more on the professional side. Facebook, do that same thing but add in a few of the personal posts, let them know that you go out to dinner, let them know that you ran a charity race, that sort of thing, once COVID ends and we’re all doing that again or how that works.
And then one thing that I think anybody using social media for either prospecting or building credibility, one thing that they forget to do is it’s not always about showing your own content. If you could go in on LinkedIn for example and you have a couple of 100 prospects on there, let’s say. If you went in every day and just went to a different prospect’s posts or what they’re sharing and you went in there and read it, made a comment, liked it, that sort of engagement. Start a conversation going, that’s going to go 10 times further than just reposting, posting, posting. That’s just something small. Let’s just say you’d set out 10 minutes every day to hop on LinkedIn and just find your prospects and comment on one of their posts or your network. Find other professionals that you’re doing and comment on that and you’re going to start building those relationships because it’s absolutely out there that you can connect with people that you’d want to be in your circle and you can start those conversations very easily through social media.
What are the implications of having a personal Facebook page that prospects and clients can see? And should people have multiple profiles? Or do advisors need to be careful about what they put even in their personal profiles? Or what’s your advice to advisors about that kind of thing?
Mostly what I see is advisors will have a personal page that’s friends and family and then they’ll create a business page with their name and their firm name or something like that. You absolutely have to be careful what you’re posting on either way. Make sure if you’re going to post stuff on your personal page, just pay attention to who can see that, who can research you because now information is absolutely free and it’s sitting in your hands six hours a day where they can stalk you online. Whatever you post on social media, just pay attention that your privacy settings and all that, that your prospects might see that.
But usually on Facebook, you can have your own personal page where you’re talking about whatever with your friends and people from high school and all that good stuff and then you can just make a business page on there that’s a little bit more professional that you can share your business practices, as well as a little bit of your personal stuff on there. That’s what we would recommend for Facebook. LinkedIn is going to be kind of one in the same and it’s really mostly just for a professional presence anyway.
We’ll get back to the show in just a moment, but I wanted to make you an offer in the meantime. This is Steve Wershing from Becoming Deferrable, with everything that’s changed over the past year, your clients’ needs and priorities have changed as well. How has their outlook changed? Their goals? What do they think of what you’ve done well during this trying time and what can be improved? A virtual client advisory board will give you those insights and more. Our proprietary system will teach you who to invite to your board, how to invite them, the best questions to put on the agenda. We’ll facilitate the meeting and give you five deliverables. Just send me a note, steve@theclientdrivenpractice.com and put CAB, that’s C-A-B in the subject line and I’ll send you my free report, Seven Tips on Making Your Virtual Client Advisory Board a Success. Ask us about our virtual wine tastings too. Send me a note at steve@theclientdrivenpractice.com and put C-A-B in the subject line.
I’d love to talk a bit more about where we started, which was this pivot from in person seminars. We’ve all become very used to webinars. We’ve all participating in them. How easy was it for advisors to pivot in your view from the in person type events to virtual?
It was terrible.
Well, can you be a bit more definitive?
Thanks for joining us everybody.
One thing we immediately found out was that the technology was scarier than it was difficult. That advisors were a little bit worried, what if the sound doesn’t work? What if my video doesn’t work? How do I sit? Where do I put my hands? What do I do? White Glove made a very conscious choice to say, “You know what? We’re going to do that for you. We’re going to put a human being on every single webinar we run and we’re going to handle all that stuff for you so all you got to do is sit there and talk. We got you. We’re going to train you. We’re going to coach you. Don’t worry about it.” The other thing, so the technology was just a little bit more scarier than it was difficult.
The other thing that we very quickly realized is that it’s not necessarily a different skillset, but it’s definitely a different mentality when you’re giving a webinar presentation compared to when you’re standing in front of an audience. Simple things like not knowing if they’re paying attention or seeing their engagement level. Am I talking too fast? Am I talking too high level? Am I talking too much in the details? When you’re standing in front of an audience, you can judge by the looks on their face, by if they’re falling asleep, by if they’re engaged, they’re leaning in towards you. And then you take all of those resources that professional speakers have used for years and you take those all away and now you’re talking to a screen, it’s a little bit intimidating.
And what we found is, shorten up the presentation. It’s not 90 minutes anymore. It’s 45 minutes and make sure that you’re staying very engaging. You have to speak as though everyone really, really cares what you’re saying. But then the actual platform of a webinar allows for so many more interesting ways to keep your audience’s attention that just are not possible in person. Things like you can run a poll while you’re speaking to your audience and they can fill it in. And then you can get immediate feedback on the screen of, hey, 75% of the audience felt this way or that way. Or they’ve never thought about the tax implications on their Social Security. You can do that stuff while you’re running a webinar and you wouldn’t necessarily be able to do that in person or not as effectively anyway. The other thing, go ahead.
Yeah. I wanted to ask about that because that is, and sorry for interrupting because I would like to hear about other things that you can do too, but in regard to polls specifically, I’ve participated in webinars like I’m sure lots of the listeners have where somebody takes a poll and then they just kind of keep going on. And every once in a while, it’s interesting to see how the group feels about something or to get that kind of feedback. But do you ever see speakers who actually sort of navigate the presentation differently based on what they’re seeing in polls? Or is there a way to sort of incorporate the poll results into the presentation itself?
The short answer is yes, you can do that. You can generally speaking if you’re going to run a poll, you’re going to know what the audience has to say. It’s like one of those things you’re asking a question, even though you already know the answer. But the idea, the real benefit of it isn’t necessarily to change what you wanted to talk about. The real benefit is that instead of scrolling my Facebook off to the side or playing Minecraft, I’m now clicking a button and engaging with what the speaker wants to talk about. That’s the whole mentality. You’re putting their brain on focus mode, on interaction mode, on pay attention mode and that’s the real point of that poll. You could ask what’s your favorite color? It doesn’t matter, but them interacting with you and then paying attention and then subconsciously thinking, well, I have to keep paying attention because he might ask me another question. And it’s a really interesting thing if you think about it, that when you’re asked a question, it’s just ingrained in you at the deepest level that you have to provide an answer.
And I might argue there’s also a benefit in seeing that other people feel the same way or differently. I think it’s sort of another innate need that we have that creates a sense of community or something on that particular webinar, which is a separate point.
Well and Julie, to that point, I would say that one of the powers of a poll is to overcome some things that people may not want to talk about. And if they realize, oh, we’re all in the same boat together, then it makes them feel okay about addressing it or admitting to it.
And there’s this just natural when you sit in an audience and you’re participating in a webinar, you’re watching a seminar, any of that, when you sit in that audience, everyone says, “Well, their initial thought is, you know what? This isn’t for me, he’s not speaking about me. She’s not talking about my situation. I’m different than everybody else in this room.” And doing a poll where they’re answering the same or they’re answering similarly or they can see that other people are in the same situation as them, what that does is just brings you into the fold where, okay you know what? This is applicable to me. I should be paying more attention.
Interesting. Okay. I’m sorry. Go ahead, Julie.
I was just going to say, he just sort of said that, so advisors rightly or understandably, were struggling with some of the things that I think professional speakers have had to learn. I’ve always joked that you could put me in an empty room and I would deliver in the same way as I did because you kind of you get used to that.
You have to.
And that’s the skill that we’re asking advisors to learn or to have. What else was coming up in terms of obstacles? And I’d love to hear about how was that everybody? Or were there some advisors who just said, “No, this is working for me,” and really made that work?
Oh sure. You get those guys that are just good at everything. And I wish I was one of those people, but they hit the ground running. They adapted, they tried it, they recorded it, they watched it back and they said, “Oh man, that was terrible. I’m going to do it again.” And that’s something that advisors often struggle with is, you know what? Let’s review it and let’s make sure that it’s even better. We actually built into our process an option where the advisor can record a webinar before they ever host one with us and we go through a 100 point process of these are all the things. We watched a 1,000 webinars that advisors gave and we figured out the ones that, hey, these are really successful. And oh, these ones are not. Well, what’s different?
And we came up with a 100 point scorecard, if you will. And we’ll grade that with the advisor and say, “Hey, these are things that we can improve on,” so they’re not practicing in front of prospects. But yeah, there was those guys that knocked it out of the park right away and then there’s other people that tried it once and gave up. And then after the pandemic, it’s no longer five weeks, it’s a year long. It’s okay, what can we do? Let’s look at this again. And then by then we had enough data to say, “Hey, these are the things that really work well. And this is what we need to focus on.”
I’d like to ask a little bit about that because you’d said, well, there are these folks that do everything well and so they had no problem with it. I just want to make sure that nobody listening to this conversation thinks, oh well, I’m not good at everything so this is not going to work for me. What kinds of skills do you see? What kinds of things can an advisor do if they’re contemplating doing a webinar that would help make that successful?
It’s really like anything else in life, you have to practice it. I naturally have to do things about 30 or 40 times before I’m any good at it. I’m hitting my 35th podcast, so maybe if you guys have me back on in a couple of months, I’ll be good at it. But really it’s translating your human self into a different setting than you’re used to. And a lot of the same things you would do in person, you just have to modify when you’re doing something virtually. And some of the things that advisors that, you know what? I’m just not comfortable presenting to my laptop. Well, we had a couple of advisors, they’d put a big mirror behind their laptops so they could see how they were speaking, there was that little bit of feedback there. They’re like, okay, you know what? This works better.
Or you push a laptop in front of you, you put your office staff, a couple of people behind it and you speak to them and it’s just night and day of how much better you get at doing that. I was very similar. I did a lot of in person speaking in 2019, standing on a stage, talking to people, getting their feedback, you tell a joke, it doesn’t work, you move on. And translating into a webinar format, the first few I hated it.
I was like, I don’t know if anybody’s paying attention. This is awful. I don’t have that normal feedback that I get. I can’t see anybody nodding their head. I can’t see anybody smiling. It’s just totally just cramping my style. And this isn’t working. And I probably did 40 webinars last year. Gotten virtually in front of probably 10,000 advisors and I love it now. I love it. And it’s just, you just have to bring that energy back to it. You’re not going to be good at it right away. You just have to keep practicing and get at it and get some feedback. Be coachable. That’s everything in life. Just be coachable if you want to be better at something.
Well, and let me ask you, because we’re talking about how to make this better, but maybe the first question we should have asked is why is this a skill worth developing? What is the impact? And how are advisors using webinars? Is it prospects? Clients? Both?
It’s absolutely both. And this will never go away. And I fully believe that. We just rang the largest and loudest bell and told every one of your clients and prospects that not only can they get that information without coming to see you, but they can sit at home in their pajamas and learn anything they want and do almost everything virtually. And there’s going to be people that are just desperate to get back out into the real world, they’ll go back to seminars. They’ll drive down to the local library and there’s going to be people that say, “You know what? I’m not comfortable with that. I’m going to stay at home and I’m going to learn it virtually.” And there’s people that are just going to say, “You know what? It’s just more convenient if I flip open my laptop, as opposed to getting in the car and driving somewhere.”
If you’re an advisor that is unwilling to meet people virtually, to prospect virtually to use webinars, you have to acknowledge that there’s a certain percentage of your ideal client that will only do that and if you’re not willing to speak to them in that fashion, someone else will.
Yeah. That makes sense.
Interesting.
What topics do you find are getting the most traction these days?
It’s interesting enough because probably four or five years ago in the seminar world, we started really seeing an uptick in taxes and retirement. How is your retirement affected by taxes? And when we would talk to advisors about it, it was, I’m not a CPA. I don’t want to talk about that. And it was like pulling teeth to get these guys to do it because the marketing was working so well. And there was tons of interest in it. That topic in itself, the advisor world has embraced it and there is consistent demand. One thing that’s nice about taxes is they’re always changing and nobody understands them and they absolutely will have an impact on your retirement. Taxes and retirement seems to be doing really well.
And one of the topics that’s actually outpacing advisors’ supply, if you will, is estate planning or generational planning. We have what we see on the marketing end is the marketing for that, the consumer demand to learn about how do I protect my wealth and make sure it gets to the grandkids? That topic resonates very, very well in the consumer community. The advisor community is a little bit slow to pick up on, you know what? I’m willing to talk about that and I’m willing to get in front of people and educate them on that. The demand is actually outpacing the supply when it comes to the estate planning, generational planning type topics.
And how do you gauge that? How do you determine that demand is exceeding supply?
Well, we have a bunch of crazy algorithms and we have green zone technology basically. And not to get too far into the weeds, but we’ll take a look at a geographical territory. We see what type of events are going on there. We analyze what type of ads are running in that particular area at that particular time. And then when we layer on the financial data and then we use our algorithm to start running tests in that area, we can see which ones are going to tick up faster or are going to get a better response rate than others.
Okay. We’ve done the webinar now, let’s go to the next step. What are the differences in following up participants and converting them into clients between webinars and the traditional in person seminar?
What’s really interesting is you have a lot of opportunities doing a webinar that you wouldn’t necessarily have in person. In person you have your event at 6:30, at 7:30 it’s wrapping up, you’re asking them for the fill out this yellow form, drop it off with Joe in the back end before you leave. And then the next day you’re hopping on the phone or shooting them an email and trying to wrestle those people into a first appointment. Whereas a webinar, what you can do is you can structure your presentation to have trial closes throughout. And what you can do is you can actually put your calendar right in the chat. You can put your calendar right on the screen. You can put a lead form on there where they can sign up and talk about something.
Let’s just say you were talking about taxes and you finish your first section and you say, “Now, if you want to talk about your personal situation as it reflects on what we just talked about, grab a 15 minute meeting with me right here. Here’s my calendar.” And then you move on. But you have that ability to do that multiple times throughout that virtual presentation so people can book at their convenience directly on your calendar using technology.
The other thing that’s really, really interesting is when you finish a webinar, let’s say you do a webinar at 6:00 o’clock, it’s 45 minutes. It’s not even 7:00 o’clock yet and the webinar is over. You can actually call everybody that attended that webinar, that same day. Maybe you do one in the afternoon and you know they’re available because they just spent 45 minutes sitting there on their laptop, now they’re going to pick up the phone and a nice warm phone call to say, “Hey, you know what? Thanks for attending my webinar. I noticed maybe you had some questions. I just wanted to make sure you could take this time to grab 15 minutes on my schedule or I can just answer them for you right now.”
But we saw immediately the advisors that were calling directly after that webinar was over, were seeing way higher book rates and much higher success. And we actually added onto our service where White Glove will do that first round of calls. That webinar ends and White Glove picks up the phone and calls all those people for that advisor, trying to book meetings for them. But those things are available when you do something virtual and they’re not when you do them in person.
And one final tip that I’ll throw out there is that using video and using the recording in your follow up sequence has seen massive conversions for us. You can actually take a video of yourself, shoot it to all the registrants and say, “Hey, thank you for attending,” or, “Sorry you missed it. Here’s the recording of the webinar. Please find a time on my schedule and we can go over your specific questions.” But if you put your face on video in that email and there’s a lot of different cool services that’ll do that Loom or BombBomb or you can even use Zoom to do it. But if you do that in the follow up, then people get to see you and it’s a little bit more of a personal touch. And that recording is right there for them to watch at their convenience, whereas a seminar, you do it and that message is gone.
Can I ask you about when you are following up on behalf of advisors? How’s that gone where it’s not the personal connection with the advisor? How do you create that bridge?
Well, what’s interesting with our service is when we market those events, that we are marketing under an educational topic and then the advisor gets on as the speaker and presenter on behalf of taxes and retirement. And there’s some added credibility there because it’s a five star rated brand, it’s rated by the Better Business Bureau, it’s strictly educational so it really lowers a bunch of walls already just being a speaker and presenter on behalf of. And when we make those follow-up calls, we’re able to kind of bridge that gap in that fashion. Hey, thank you for attending this educational workshop. I’m calling on behalf of the presenter. Let’s grab a time slot on his calendar and we can do that directly for them. They don’t have to re follow-up with somebody else. They can book right on the calendar after that event.
Yeah. That makes sense when it’s positioned in that way.
Right. Well, so this is really good stuff and I’d love to keep talking. We are at the end of our time however, so in closing, what would you suggest advisors think about doing, putting on their to do list today to explore what new opportunities there are for connecting with people, especially if they were doing seminars before?
If they were doing seminars before, I think a lot of advisors either were a little bit afraid of webinars or maybe they tried it once and they didn’t see success. And what I would say is, you know what? Shoot a webinar, give it over to White Glove, we’ll take a look at it and we’ll help you. And if you don’t end up using us, you go do it on your own, we’re still here to help. But absolutely just give it a try. And whether you do that to your clients or your current prospects or you use our services to get in front of new households, webinars absolutely are going to be a staple of effective marketing moving forward.
Okay. Well, you’ve sort of transitioned over to this already, but where can listeners find you and White Glove if they wanted to find out more?
Well, we try to make it very easy, so just whiteglove.com and then I practice what I preach. If they want, if anybody wants additional help from me directly, just stalk me on LinkedIn, Brad Swineheart and you should be able to find me on there. And I’d be happy to answer any follow-up questions.
Great.
Brad, thanks so much for joining us. It was great to talk with you.
Thanks, Brad.
It was a lot of fun. As you promised, it was a lot of fun.
Okay. Thanks.
Hi, it’s Julie again. It was great to have you with us on Becoming Deferrable. If you like what you’ve been hearing, please do us a favor and rate us on iTunes. It really does help. You can get all the links, show notes and other tidbits from these episodes at becomingreferrable.com. You can also get our free report, Three Referral Myths That Limit Your Growth, and connect with our blogs and other resources. Thanks so much for joining us.